Two items appear below:

1 No Smoke...Just Another Con          Brian De Kretser
2 Historians and Jesus                         Anonymous


NO SMOKE, NO FIRE, JUST ANOTHER CON

(Investigator 129, 2009 November)

Brian de Kretser


Dawkins, Hitchens, Stenger and many other authors too numerous to name, present historical evidence backed up by plenty of scholars and researches that J.C. did not exist.

This is always disputed by card carrying me members of the god squad and their many agents (believers) who suggest that there cannot be smoke without a fire. Something miraculous did happen in the 1st century AD - Certainly lots of things took place, but no J.C. miracles, not a word.

Let us put aside modern authors and their sources for a moment and go straight back act to the 1st. century, the time in which J.C. was said to have lived and performed his wondrous works. Listed below are a number of writers and historians, many highly reputed for their works. They all lived and wrote during the time or within a century after the time that J.C. is said to have lived, performed miracles, raised the dead, cured the sick and blind, walked on water, etc. followed everywhere he went by great multitudes of people.

Let us start with Philo-Judaeus (20 BC - 50 AD) Philo wrote an account of the Jews covering the entire time that J.C. is said to have existed on earth. Philo was living in or near Jerusalem when J.C.'s miraculous birth and Herod's massacre occurred. He was there when J.C. made his triumphal entry into Jerusalem. He was there for the crucifixion and all the world shattering events that followed — earthquakes, the sun becoming dark at noon, the graves opening and the dead and long dead saints roaming about the place., supposedly seen by many, also when J.C. himself rose from the dead and in the presence of many witnesses ascended into heaven, but Philo saw nothing, heard nothing, wrote nothing.

Flavius Josephus, the renowned Jewish historian, born 37 AD was a contemporary of the apostles. He was for a time the governor of Galilee, where J.C. lived and taught. Josephus wrote of every important event during the first 70 years AD but J.C. did not get a mention. Later the Josephus writings were interpolated and forgeries which mention J.C. added on. This short forgery was labeled by Bishop Warburton as "a rank forgery and a very stupid one too…" It is mentioned in the Church History, that this was the word of the very dishonest bishop Eusebius. The Catholic Encyclopedia admits that the forged passages were not known to Origen and earlier church writers.

Justus Tiberius was a native of Galilee, he wrote a history covering the period of J.C.'s reputed existence. This work was destroyed, but Photius a Christian scholar and critic of the 9th century who was acquainted with it says that Justus made not a mention of J.C. or his wondrous works.

There were also interpolations and forgeries in the works of Pliny the younger and historian Tacitus (who was born about 20 years after the purported death of J.C.

Due to modern science these are now recognized as forgeries by all scholars both Christian and secular. A total of about 40 to 50 interpolated lines are the only supporting evidence of the existence of J.C. a man-god who supposedly shook up the whole world of that period.

The other historians of that time, Arrian, Lucius Seneca (4 BC - 65 AD) Dion Pruseus, Pliny the Elder, Pater Calus, Suetonius, Juvenal, Theon of Smyran, Martial, Phlegon, Persius, Pompon Mela, Plutarch, Quintus Curtius, Lucian, Apollonius, Pausanias, Valerius Flaccus, Quintilian, Forus Lucius, Lucanus, Phaedrus, Epictetus, Damis, Silius Italicus, Alulus Geuius, Statius, Ptolemy, Columella, Diochry Sostom, Hermogones, Lysias, Valerius Maxiimus, Cornelius, Titus Livius, Cluvius Rufus, Publius Petronius (the Roman consul) who lived in Jerusalem. All these heard nothing, not a word was written about J.C.

These historians wrote about early religions but never mentioned J.C. or the spectacular events that the church said accompanied J.C.'s life. It is easy to come to the conclusion that the J.C. story is pure fiction. The deafening silence by all the historians and writers of that era is the most damning proof that J.C. never existed, and all the stories that the church promoted to try and back up a non-existing character are all made up of myths and legends of past gods.

The church and believers have no answer to this although they trot out various excuses from time to time. This evidence is set in concrete. The god of the Hebrews did not exist before the 6th century BC. All deities who preexisted were named — Brahma, Horus, Osiris, Isis, Marduk, Ahuramazda.

After these there were many others — Allah had to wait till the 5th century AD to be invented by Muhammad.

It is all summed up very nicely by Pope Leo X (Giovanni De Medice) who was Pope 1513-1521. At a Vatican feast he toasted with a glass of wine held high, "How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable of Christ has been for us and our predecessors…" The Church  tried to hide this unsuccessfully, because it was recorded by two who were present, Cardinals Bembo and Jovius.

Subsequently the Vatican had to admit that the Pope had spoken the truth.

J.C. still remains a mythical figure, a story made up of recycled myths and legends. It incorporated many elements from tales of other deities listed below:

1.    Krishna of Hindustan. 17.    Adad of Assyria.
2.    Buddha of India. 18.    Alcides of Thebes.
3.    Slivahana of Bermuda 19.    Devatat and Sammonocadam of Siam.
4.    Crite of Chaldea. 20.    Micado of Sintoos.
5.    Zulis, Osiris, Jorus of Egypt. 21.    Beddru of Japan.
6.    Atys of Phrygia. 22.    Eros and Bremrillah of the Druids.
7.    Odin of Scandinavia. 23.    Thor of Gaul.
8.    Indra of Tibet. 24.    Cadmus of Greece.
9.    Zoroaster and Mithra of Persia 25.    Fohi and Tien of China.
10.    Jao of Nepal.  26.    Hil and Feta of the Mandaites.
11.    Baal and Taut of Phoenicia. 27.    Ischy of Formosa.
12.    Bail of Afghanistan. 28.    Gentaut and Quexalcote of Mexico.
13.    Wittoba of Balingonese. 29.    Adonis of Greece.
14.    Thammuz of Syria. 30.    Prometheus of Caucasus.
15.    Xamolxis of Thrace. 31.    Ixion and Quirinus of Rome.
16.    Zoar of Bonzes. 32.    Allah of Arabia
 

There are many, many more. All were word saviors and creators, many crucified and rose from the dead and into heaven same as J.C., born of a virgin, sexually molested by a god etc, (sounds familiar?) Mostly all the above predate the Christian myth.


REFERENCES


The Christ - John E. Remsburg.
Life of Jesus - Ernest Renan.
The world's16 crucified saviors – Kersey Graves.
The crucifixion of truth – Tony Bushby.
The bible fraud – Tony Bushby.
The origins of Christianity and the quest for the historical Jesus Christ – Acharya S.
The fable of Christ - Luigi Cascioli.







HISTORIANS and JESUS

Anonymous

(Investigator 130, 2010 January)


If someone sees "no smoke, no fire" (#129) it may be that his eyes are closed.

The existence of Jesus was debated by scholars in the 19th century. The conclusion was that the Jesus on whom the Gospels are based did live in the 1st century.

The debate moved on to the "historical Jesus". Critics in this part of the dispute assumed the New Testament is wrong in MANY details, especially the miraculous aspects. The aim, therefore, was/is to uncover the "real" or "historical" Jesus.

The extreme view that there was no Jesus on whom the New Testament is based is not a mainstream academic position but is promoted by writers on the theological/historical fringe.

Such fringe-writers often argue that:
1.    Historians of the 1st and 2nd centuries don't mention Jesus.
2.    Parallel lives of Jesus and other "saviors" suggest the Jesus story was adapted from Pagan mythology.

PARALLEL LIVES

The argument that similarities between Jesus and Pagan stories prove Jesus is myth was answered in #129.

The best set of parallels is with the Hindu god Krishna. However, the writings about Krishna were completed centuries after the Christian writings. Also Christianity spread to India and not Hinduism to Israel or to Rome. Therefore, if anyone copied it was the Hindus.

I refer readers to #129 for more information about the copycat hypothesis and why mainstream scholars ignore it.


HISTORIANS

De Kretser (#129) listed Roman era historians and says, "The deafening silence by all the historians and writers of that era is the most damning proof that J.C. never existed."

If "deafening silence" is proof of non-existence then China, America and Australia, and plenty of other things that existed must be myths and didn't exist. If Roman-era historians are the final word then numerous peoples such as Japanese and Australian Aborigines didn't exist.

What about Josephus and Philo who were first-century Jewish writers? Wouldn't they have written about Jesus?

Like historians today Josephus focused on political and violent events. Philo was a religious thinker who tried to explain Jewish belief in terms of Greek philosophy and wrote very little about first-century Judea.

Peaceful religious meetings rarely make news or get a mention in histories of the world or of particular nations. This is true now and was true of ancient writers. There are 20th century Christian evangelists who in Africa and India addressed vast crowds of one or two million people, but who get no mention in popular history books. Literally thousands of news writers and historians around the world ignore such gatherings if they were peaceful. If there's violence, however, then even a small cult becomes newsworthy.

It is also often the case that historians:
1.    Ignore whatever they consider unimportant;
2.    Avoid mentioning political or religious positions they disagree with so as "not to advertise the opposition";
3.    May simply be unaware or uninformed.

Even world-shaking modern events scrutinized by hundreds of historians may get misrepresented.

For example, for 60 years Hitler's Eastern Front 1943 offensive, the Battle of Kursk, was portrayed as a German military disaster. In that battle Germany's greatest-ever concentration of armor crashed into the most powerful defensive positions ever constructed. Ludwig Dyck writes: "Over 2 million men, 35,000 guns, 6,250 tanks and assault guns, and 4,900 aircraft were flung at each other by two merciless totalitarian regimes, each bent on the utter annihilation of its foe." (WWII History, September 2006) The day-8 high-point, when German and Soviet tank armies collided, became known to historians as the "death ride of the panzers". Now new research suggests that Kursk (including Day 8) was a "brilliant tactical victory" for Hitler and might have achieved much more had he committed his reserves instead of calling it off.

The message here is that events of world importance scrutinized by hundreds of historians over decades — even in modern times with modern communications — can be incorrectly assessed. What then about unimportant events?
 

MARGINAL EVENTS

Events considered unimportant by historians and for that reason omitted in popular history books, may nevertheless get written up by the people involved in those events. There are millions of churches, clubs, organizations, employers and government-offices that publish reports, magazines, journals and even books.

We should not arbitrarily declare the information in such special-interest publications to be false, or the people non-existent, merely because historians writing on world history don't mention them.

Any special-interest publications should, if they later gain international attention, be assessed for accuracy on their own merits and not arbitrarily declared false because historians ignored them.   

The same applies to the New Testament and what it says about Jesus. The Gospels were "special interest" writings by a small, peaceful group in a remote province and of no interest to distant historians writing for Roman readers.

The New Testament must therefore be assessed by whatever content we can check or test today and not arbitrarily dismissed because certain historians didn't mention the same material.

That's what I've done for decades. I search the Bible for statements that can be tested by reference to scientific and historical documents or by observations in today's world. Hundreds of formerly disputed statements have been confirmed, and this trend shows no sign of stopping.

There is also prophecy. The Bible predicted that Jesus would have world-wide impact upon all nations. We see this fulfilled in thousands of Christian schools, hospitals and charities, and with the Gospel available in over 2000 languages. H. G. Wells, a 20th century historian, called Jesus the "centre of history".

There is then no "deafening silence" except for people willingly deaf.



The New Testament and the Old Testament examined and debated on this website:

http://users.adam.com.au/bstett/

http://ed5015.tripod.com/